I stated at the outset of our conversation that this blog has been critical of the actions of the Board, and of Mr. Krasnicki, in the dispute with the Archbishop over the proper administration of the former parish. I also gave my opinion that the fiasco of Fr. Bozek's leadership there is one consequence, intended or not, of the actions of the Board. In other words, I did not wish to be a hypocrite and pretend that there is no longer a disagreement over many substantive issues. That being said, the effort to remove Bozek is a necessary and beneficial one to all Catholics, whatever their opinion on the original dispute. With that understanding, Mr. Krasnicki agreed to be interviewed for publication here.
In light of the above, excerpts from this interview that relate to Fr. Bozek and Mr. Krasnicki's effort to lobby the Board to remove him appear below. The conversation began with the decision to hire Bozek. According to Krasnicki, Bozek did not begin to advocate his “vision for the Church” until after his immigration status was resolved:
Q: I was wondering about that.
A: [Bishop of Springfield-Cape Girardeau] Leibrecht notified the USCIS that his employment was terminated and therefore he’s out. Well they notified him that they were going to send him back to Poland. And the parish Board of Directors spent I guess close to $80,000 working with [a local law firm]. And so, they got him back into the country—he went over and got his visa, came back and everything was o.k.
Q: You weren’t claiming 501(c)(3) under the Archdiocese anymore, were you?
A: No, the Diocese notified us that it had notified the service that we were off the chart. We then went out and applied for a 501(c)(3) and got it. So we’ve had that—it was a matter of days—we anticipated that happening. And then no sooner than he gets his green card he starts making announcements about his different beliefs and open communion and all this stuff.
Q: Would he do this at Mass?
A: Yeah.
Q: How long ago did he start to manifest that kind of agenda?
A: I guess it’s been a year, maybe a little more. You know, there were hints of that before.
Q: I suppose the questions about why he left the seminary were known, and that was why you questioned him?
A: Yeah. And anyway, and some people, including myself, who thought I was pretty smart, we found ourselves with this snake. And unfortunately there were two members of the Board—the two senior members of the Board—the chairman and the treasurer who are father-in-law and son-in-law—really pushed for Father’s agenda. Whether they pushed for the agenda or not, they pushed for him. And they had an opportunity to get rid of him. The Board voted, we had a meeting at one of their homes—
Q: When was this?
A: It was late June or early July of 2007. I presented a case to them and they had been in discussion with their outside attorney as well and we all came to the conclusion that he should be fired—including the canon lawyer. It was put in the hands of the chairman to do it and he never did. Nothing happened, and then I started to get terribly irritated.
Q: Were you still the attorney for the Board then?
A: I was still the attorney for the Board and an advisor to them.
Q: And you were never a member of the Board?
A: I was never a member of the Board. And then, it just got so out of hand that I resigned. It was September 27th.
Q: Every time they show a report about the Church on the news they inevitably show that Christmas Eve 2005 Mass. How many people do you really believe attend Mass there on Sundays?
A: That really attend there on Sunday? Maybe about 200 at all three Masses.
Q: You mean combined?
A: Combined.
Q: O.K. So if you added up all the people at all three Masses you’d get 200?
A: Yeah.
Q: And of that number what percentage were members of the historic Polish parish?
A: Percentage-wise? You know, it is kind of hard to say right now. The percentage has shrunk a great deal. But there might be 20 percent, 25 percent now.
But anyway, that brings us up to pretty close where we are now. I resigned, and I told the Board of Directors that they were the most spineless bunch of people I ever met in not doing anything. But they are so overwhelmed with their newfound popularity.
Q: Right.
A: Now there are two directors who have stood steadfast against them: Bob Zabielski and Stan Rosanski. And these guys have gotten insulted and ignored, but they are only two of seven—there are six lay directors and the priest.
Q: He has a voting role?
A: He does have a right to vote, yeah.
Q: Now Bozek, is he still hearing confessions, do you know?
A: As far as I know, yes. He’s given last rites in the last couple of weeks, to a couple of people.
Q: And what about marriages?
A: Marriages, you know, quite a few. I think he says he’s done something like 200—I can’t be held to that number, but I think that’s what he said yesterday.
Q: Is he confirming anybody?
A: He did confirm some people, yes.
Q: How many?
A: Maybe a half a dozen.
Q: From the time you mention he started advancing his agenda, would he say these things in the homily, or is it something he’s doing behind the scenes, or both.
A: Both. He’s been very open about the confirmations, the weddings.
Q: There seems to be some level of coordination between Bozek and that womanpriest crowd. That scene from yesterday—that’s how they work it. They show up in force in places and they make it look like there is this groundswell of popular support. They’re not interested in logic.
A: Yeah.
Q: In light of what’s happening with Bozek, and that there are a large number of disaffected parishioners obviously, do you think that if you went back to the Archdiocese with [a proposal for settlement] it might be met with a better reception?
A: Honestly, I doubt it. I would like it to happen.
Q: In light of everything that’s happened, you might get enough votes to oust Bozek.
A: You know, we don’t need a vote of the parish to do that. The Board has to get the spine to do it.
Q: The one quote that bugged me the most from that channel 2 story was when you were talking and they were telling you to go to some other parish—and you said, you go to some other parish. These are the inclusive people, yet if you don’t like the inclusive people they tell you to jump in a lake.
A: Exactly. You know, I will publicly say-- and I have said but they just haven’t published it—I am very remorseful for what I’ve done. I feel terrible. I feel that my actions have led to this by bringing this idiot in, and I feel great responsibility for it.
Q: It is good to hear you say that. The readers of my blog tend to be pretty traditional, and I think that might go a long way.
A: I would say it to the Archbishop or anybody. I’ve shed—excuse me—a lot of tears over this. A lot.
Q: What do think is Bozek’s agenda, assuming laicization takes place? What is he going to do, where will he go for his Bishop, his orders and all of that?
A: Well, he has told members of the Board that he has two Bishops that are willing to incardinate him. One is Emmanuel Milingo, you know, the Moonie. The other one is Philip Zimmerman of the Reformed Catholic Church in Texas. Now he prefers Milingo.
Q: Of course. Anything goes in sexual matters.
A: Yeah, and the thing with Milingo, also, that troubles me and I said yesterday is that there is indisputable evidence of his willingness to violate Roman dogma. And Bozek swears he’s with all the dogma.
Q: He’s playing a dangerous game there because he’s claiming the teaching against the ordination of women doesn’t rise to the level of infallibility but that’s wrong.
A: Be that as it may, the point I want to make is Milingo subscribes to Moon. And Moon has said that he has been told directly by God that he is here to accomplish those things that Jesus failed to do. Now, Jesus is true God and true Man. God doesn’t make mistakes. God doesn’t fail to finish anything.
Q: Don’t you think that’s the same thing Bozek is saying when he says that his message will make the Church more Christ-like and do things in a more Christian way as though Christ wasn’t capable of setting up His Church to do that?
A: Right. You know, I never thought of it that way. That’s the hand and the glove.
Q: Milingo, that’s huge. He said that, he said the name Milingo?
A: Yeah, I got it from him—one of the directors got it from him and emailed it to me.
Q: There was speculation out there that he might go with the PNCC, but they don’t allow the ordination of women.
A: Oh, the PNCC wouldn’t have him.
Q: And the Utrecht crowd?
A: That would be Zimmerman. The PNCC is no longer in the Union of Utrecht. My father and grandparents were PNCC, on my father’s side of the family. And the latest statement of union from them and the statement from the Vatican that they are considering bringing the PNCC back, that there are no dogmatic differences, as a sister church as in the [Maronite] rite is very encouraging. Be that as it may, the people don’t want the PNCC. They want Bozek—
Q: They want all the cachet of being Catholic.
A: Yeah.
Q: When they’re not.
A: Yeah. Bozek is painting them with the same heretical brush that he is painting himself with.
Q: The meeting on Sunday concerned some questions about how the Board was using Church assets with regard to Bozek. What is the situation with the vehicle?
A: He had a BMW on lease when he came up here, and the Board continued the lease. Later, they leased him a new BMW without a vote of the full Board.
Q: And does he live in the rectory?
A: He has been wanting to get out of the rectory for a long time, so there have been negotiations with him to give him a bigger salary, instead of the previous one that included room and board. Within the last couple of weeks, Bozek has turned down as insufficient a salary of approximately $58,000.
Q: What was the arrangement in the past?
A: The salary had been about $19,000, but it also included room, board, expenses, retirement and health insurance.
Q: What is the status of his residence now?
A: In addition to Bozek wanting to leave the rectory, it is also the case that the school, which is becoming dilapidated, had to be torn down. The Board thought they could use the rectory for storage and classrooms. Originally, the Board and Bozek identified a two bedroom apartment on 5th Street near the Church, but Bozek turned that down. Later, a son of one of the Board members, who is a real estate agent, found a townhouse near 18th & Cass. Due to possible conflict of interest, the matter was temporarily dropped, and I don't know the current status.
Q: What is the latest you have heard about Bozek's plans?
A: I have learned that he plans a press conference at the Polish Heritage Center (PHC) at 11:00 or 12:00 on March 5th to make a “major” announcement. This obviously means that he will not be meeting with Abp. Burke. He has done this without the authorization or approval of the Board. Bob Zabielski and Stan Rozanski were surprised and dismayed by my report of this to them. Further, it is reported that he will allow only those with Press credentials to attend. Convenient, eh? He has no authority whatsoever to restrict anyone from coming to the PHC. More battle lines are drawn. From a different and reliable source, I’ve learned that not only has he purchased a bishop’s cross and ring (which I have personally seen) but he has now purchased a crosier for himself!
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25 comments:
cajunpork posted:
Excellent interview. (You're almost becoming a "real" journalist. :) ) Mr. Krasnicki should know that he is in the prayers of many people. What a horrific situation this is.
God Bless you Mr. Krasnicki. Good job, SLC.
OKAY, AND ALL YOU PRIESTS AND THEOLOGIANS ON THIS BLOG. HELP A POOR LAYMAN OUT!!!
If Milingo "incardinates" Bozek then...
1.) Even if for a few months he has a new bishop (Milingo) Bozek's laicization makes the incardination moot. True?
2.) Does St. Stans' become a parish in a new diocese or does the supression cancel that out?
3.) Will the Milingo incardination even be valid?
4.) Once laicized can the African Bishop come over here and re-ordain Bozek creating a need for a whole new laicization?
Inquiring minds need to know.
Good job, Timman!
Anon, I will await events before addressing the validity of a possible Milingo consecration (it would be obviously illict, but validity is more complicated). I am praying I don't have to undertake that research project.
An excellent blog post, one that truly shows the power of this new media when put to use by enterprising and orthodox minds like the T-man.
Now, the question is: What is the major announcement for tomorrow?
I wonder if someone will claim to be a bishop himself.
P.S. Three cheers for this good man, Mr. K, agreeing to this interview and for his contrition and public repentance. He is in my prayers too.
Great interview. The STL PD and TV stations need to cite you!
Wolftracker,
You're reading my mail. I have thought for several weeks that our our Bozek would attend his meeting with His Excellancy and call it an "Episcopal Conference". (LOL)
As for Archb. Milingo he has ventured into American territory before. He has recognized the breakaway church of George Stallings in D.C. I wonder if St. Stan's will now become part of a breakaway African American Communion.
Seriously folks.
I really do wonder how long this joke can go on. We're about to witness the birth of an African-Gay-Polish-Transgendered CHurch where the most ordinary Catholics in the congregation are merely the divorced who have re-married.
C'mon, what the heck is going to happen to that vaunted "Polish Heritage Center" after the actual Polish in the Parish drops to 10 percent.
This whole fight was supposed to be about defending "Polish Heritage". So they link up with an African exorcist who heals over the telephone.
Evelyn Waugh couldn't have come up with a nuttier character than Bozek.
I think we should all relax. This thing will die of laughter. I'm serious. If Roger K. is right there is no way something like this can stay financially stable. The whole place will go into foreclosure and the Archbishop of St. Louis will buy it off the auction block, then give it back to the Poles at St. Agatha.
You heard it here first.
Milingo being excommunicated and without a diocese cannot incardinate any priest. Also, the process of incardination expects a valid excardination by the proper ordinary/superior, which I would doubt the present and future bishops of Spring.-Cape to grant. If Bozek pretends to be a bishop, even more penalties are applied. To all the "Save St. Stan's" people, I would say that you reap what you sow...but there is always mercy, so come back, ask forgiveness and let's start the healing! Catholics have enough enemies outside the Church; we don't need to waste time and energy fighting each other.
I also applaud you, SLC, for your "scoop". And, I admire Mr. Krasnicki for his forthrightness in admitting he made a huge error in judgment.
I'm not one to get into name-calling, but since this whole St. Stan's issue has become a 3-ring circus, perhaps "Father Bozo" (the Clown) would be a fitting name for the "pastor".
Wow! What a wonderful example of pride (ahem) preceding a fall. Now, we can put to rest all the claims that this was a money grab on the Archdiocese's part.
Maybe Archbishop Burke will do the Church a favor and close St. Cronan's. Then the apostates over there can join in on the homo-sapphic "whatever it is" over at St. Stan's.
Maybe the can merge names, too: St. Crostanislaus the Sodomite, an imaginary patron saint of unrepentant apostates who hate the Roman Catholic Church. It'd be perfect for an imaginary "catholic" congregation.
As for "Bishop" Bozek. Wow! What a con man. He would make the likes of P.T. Barnum blush. Bravo, "Father", Bravo!
Great interview, one that the P-Disgrace would never conduct. Is Krasnicki back in communion with Rome or not? Wasn't he excomm'd by AB Burke too??
Apparently, at the news conference, Bozek would not name the "bishop" with whom he is seeking "incardination," and talked some nonsense about "bishops territorial and personal." He threw in a big ol' red herring by moaning about the "humiliation" to which he is being subject in the laicization process. He also indicated his intention to remain at St. Stanislaus. Sounds like he's trying to buy time to figure out how he's going to tell folks at St. Stanislaus that he's signing on with a schismatic bishop.
Well! I can see "Cry Baby Krasnicki" is at his best form. Another page in his long suffering of not getting what he wants. He obviously wasn't happy when the Mean Daddy of Lindell ripped the priest from St. Stanislaus because they would not just hand over the money and the property. He was unhappy enough to back bring Fr. Bozek to the parish so he could have his sacraments and his Masses in Polish. He was happy as long as Fr. Bozek would do what Mr. Krasnicki would give approval. Now, since Fr. Bozek is doing what the Catholic Church intimates to do, he is not happy. The Catholic Church accepts all sinners. As long as you meet the criteria. Never divorced, have been baptised in a Catholic Church, cann afford to be a member, and so forth. It is because of the criteria of the man made laws of the Catholic Church the are now second to the Muslim Religion. I have never read or have been taught that when Jesus was on Earth, a criteria must be met to hear His teaching or receive His Sacraments. Now Cry Baby is unhappy again. Fr. Bozek is not doing what he wants. Mr. Krasnicki, take your ball and bat and go home to Mommy. Cry on her shoulders. You can state your case and she will believe you. But, there are some who know and can see through your Saran Wrap exterior.
Bob, did I read this on Town Talk?
I noticed that most of the comments were signed “Anonymous” or a user name and not their real name. Only one or two talking against Father Bozek had the courage to sign their names, but then only their first. I would hope that this blog would give Father Bozak equal time. But maybe they are afraid to get the truth and only want the half-truths from Mr. Krasnicki. I say half-truths, because some of what he says are true, but they are so buried in lies, you can’t find them. I back Father Bozak because I believe, like him, that we all on this earth are children of God. We were all made in His Image, not just the ones you want to pick and choose. Mr. Krasnicki is starting to sound like Hollywood, only the beautiful get in. I do believe that is not what Jesus said or meant. The Lord may forgive, but as for me, I feel sorry for you and all the hatred you harbor. Maybe, if you lost the hatred, you might see what is really going on around you. Mr. Krasnicki, may God bless you and keep in His Heart.
The heavenly Father must be disappointed by the venom being spewed by Mr. Krasnicki. He does not speak for me, nor a great majority of St. Stanislaus Parish. There have been many votes taken, all of which speak in direct opposition of what Mr. Krasnicki is saying here. What's at the root here is power, money and control, by the Archbishop and the minority that think the way Mr. Krasnicki does. Throughout the ages, the lust for these things have been the downfall of many things. The Chritianity I learned as a child, was that of love and compassion for all people. The first and second great commandments speak directly to this. Archbishop Burke and those that are trying to hurt Fr. Bozek and the parish seem to have forgotten this. Their hearts seem to be so hardened by the lust for power and money, they're missing the point. Where is the love or compassion in what they're doing? What guides them in this quest to hurt Fr. Bozek and alot of faithful parishioners at St. Stanislaus? I am thankful, after a 20 year absence from church, that God lead Fr. Bozek to St. Stanislaus, and equally thankful that God lead me there as well. He speaks to my heart through Fr. Bozek, and I will always be thankful for that.
Please, in the name of God, stop this anger and hatred, Mr. Krasnicki! I will pray for you.
"Q: Don’t you think that’s the same thing Bozek is saying when he says that his message will make the Church more Christ-like and do things in a more Christian way as though Christ wasn’t capable of setting up His Church to do that?"
Is this question implying that the Church has been perfect ever since the time of Jesus?
I have no idea how much of what Mr. Krasnicki said is true, since I am nowhere near this issue. Nevertheless, I would like to point out that some questions (example: There seems to be some level of coordination between Bozek and that womanpriest crowd. That scene from yesterday—that’s how they work it. They show up in force in places and they make it look like there is this groundswell of popular support. They’re not interested in logic.) would be thrown out of any court in the United States in a second because "Q" is leading the "witness."
Peace,
Luke
Luke,
The Church is indefectible. From the Catholic Encyclopedia:
X. INDEFECTIBILITY OF THE CHURCH
Among the prerogatives conferred on His Church by Christ is the gift of indefectibility. By this term is signified, not merely that the Church will persist to the end of time, but further, that it will preserve unimpaired its essential characteristics. The Church can never undergo any constitutional change which will make it, as a social organism, something different from what it was originally. It can never become corrupt in faith or in morals; nor can it ever lose the Apostolic hierarchy, or the sacraments through which Christ communicates grace to men. The gift of indefectibility is expressly promised to the Church by Christ, in the words in which He declares that the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. It is manifest that, could the storms which the Church encounters so shake it as to alter its essential characteristics and make it other than Christ intended it to be, the gates of hell, i.e. the powers of evil, would have prevailed. It is clear, too, that could the Church suffer substantial change, it would no longer be an instrument capable of accomplishing the work for which God called it in to being. He established it that it might be to all men the school of holiness. This it would cease to be if ever it could set up a false and corrupt moral standard. He established it to proclaim His revelation to the world, and charged it to warn all men that unless they accepted that message they must perish everlastingly. Could the Church, in defining the truths of revelation err in the smallest point, such a charge would be impossible. No body could enforce under such a penalty the acceptance of what might be erroneous. By the hierarchy and the sacraments, Christ, further, made the Church the depositary of the graces of the Passion. Were it to lose either of these, it could no longer dispense to men the treasures of grace.
As for the question you cite, we weren't in court, it was a conversation.
Walter, Fr. Bozek practically owns the local airwaves and newspapers, and is the darling of every anti-Catholic opinion organ in the country. He has plenty of supporters who accept his propaganda without hesitation. In other words, the time isn't equal-- he gets nearly all. I would love to see the Archbishop get equal time, so that some greater number of Catholics would be warned about Bozek and perhaps not be led out of the Church.
Jack,
Lust. Power. Money. Just which party is motivated by these things?
I am a non-Catholic, although I attend St. Stans from time to time. I find father Bozek is kind, compassionate, understanding, and loving of all people - no matter their religious faith, color, ethnic group, or sexual preference. I also believe Jesus was such a man - and the true Son of God.
Father Bozek has said many times to his parishioners that he will stay with the church as long as he is needed and wanted by the congregation. They have supported him. He will leave if they stop supporting him. So please leave his status to his parishioners.
Burke has cut him off from the Church of Rome. Why don't you cut him off too. You don't believe as he does, so why keep the rhetoric going.
Leave him and his congregation in peace. Isn't freedom of religion part of our constitution.
If you ignore Fr. Bozek, the controversy may die, and since he is no longer of the Church of Rome, he should be no concern on yours.
Let him spread his good message in peace.
linda in Arnold
Linda, if Bozek will publicly state, as you have done, that he is no longer Catholic, I will be glad to leave him alone.
If you really seek to learn about the Catholic Church, you should find a priest in good standing who actually believes what she teaches.
I can't wait for the day that it is discovered that Fr. Bozek & Abp Burke are in bed together in this destruction of St. Stanislaus Kostka ... open your eyes, they are in cahoots!
Um, right. And watch that imagery you're using...
Roger, words from a wise Polish Grandma,"when you throw manure(----)on someone,some will remain on you. Grandma(Babcia)Bozek
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