29 November 2011

Rogue Parish Goes Rogue Again

If the mountain won't come to Mohamed, then Mohamed must go to the mountain.

This year, as in more recent years, but unlike in 2007, St. Cronan's will be heading out to hear Rabbi Talve at her own place. From the St. Cronan's website: 

Dec 12 (7:00 pm): Come celebrate God's gifts of peace and light at Central Reform Congregation CRC is located at the corner of Kingshighway and Waterman. (5020 Waterman Blvd. 63108) We will gather at CRC for prayer at 7:00 p.m. Rabbi Susan Talve will help us listen more deeply to the Prophet Isaiah's message to us. 

Please bring cookies or nuts to share. 

I pass over the final sentence of the announcement in silence.

Yet someone else will have to explain just how it is that promoting this endeavor squares with Cardinal (then-Archbishop) Burke's injunction on interfaith activities with the head of the CRC.


Kerry of NJ said...

Also from the website:

Sun (9-10 Between Masses ,Second Sunday of each month) Liturgy Committee meets at the back of church. All are welcome, join us.

Perhaps someone should occupy this liturgy meeting.

Anonymous said...

Are they using the new translation?


Peggy IL said...

I sure hope no one has a nut allergy. How insensitive! /s

StGuyFawkes said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Doesn't Saint Cronan's know how un-Christian it is to reach out to other denominations???

The ONLY approved inter-faith dialogue (on this site) is supposed to be with the four ex-communicated Bishops under Bishop Lefevre, one of whom denies the Holocaust. Anything else is damnable...


thetimman said...


1. You are saying, of course, that the good folks of St. Cronan's are "reaching out" to convert Rabbi Talve and her congregation to Catholicism, yes? If so, I heartily apologize. Let me know how it goes!

2. The SSPX bishops are Catholic, so that wouldn't be dealing with a different denomination; moreover, the excommunications were lifted by the Pope, so they aren't even schismatic by any definition. Williamson's denial of the commonly accepted numbers of the slain in the holocaust is his business, as I consider the likely espousal of socialized medicine by Cronanites to be theirs. Only when these things touch on articles of the Catholic faith do they become fodder for me, anyway. Each person can hold their own unusual theories of politics or history and be within the bounds of the Church. The Church's wide net captures many nuts, cranks, fools, normal joes and janes, saints and sinners. I thought that was one of the stated positions of the St. Cronan's crowd. Or does everyone have certain opinions outside of the claims of the faith that make them personae non gratae?

Anonymous said...


1. So "reaching out" to other denominations ONLY means that it has a stated purpose of conversion? Why not take it a step further and just say the only good that can come of it is if they are successful at converting those Jewish "Pagans." Otherwise, I take it, there is absolutely no reason on this planet for anyone to dialogue with Jews from your stand-point. Boy, good luck with that if/when you meet Jesus in heaven - a Jew by birth, along with St.s Mary and Joseph, and all the rest!

2. So very interesting to hear you talk about "fodder" that is or isn't appropriate to the Catholic faith. Seems that your fodder includes stating that the Church since Vatican II is "going down like the Titanic" because it chose to let the Mass be spoken in common language so people could understand it who haven't studied Latin. It is equally odd that at times you hide behind the Catholic faith when it comes to St. Cronan's, but then blast the Novus Ordo as if the Church stopped being "Catholic."

OR slamming Pope Benedict's Encyclical "Charity in Truth" which decries the economic injustices inherent in capitalism (and equally so in communism) because, apparently, they are at odds with your staunchly Republican views.

Or how dismissive you remain of Pope JPII's call to end the death penalty in this day and age as "his personal opinion."

Seems your fodder only goes one way - we get it: your God is a staunch Capitalist who demands that the only access to Him is through the Latin Mass. He daily condemns people who fall outside yours/His rigid scope of "Catholicism," and thinks any dialogue with Jews is verbotten (unless, like the Mormons, they can be converted and thus "saved.")


thetimman said...


Willfully misstating others' positions is fun. Not terribly so, but fun enough, I guess.

Anonymous said...


It is human nature (original sin?) that we can be so condemning of another person's beliefs, but so forgiving and accepting of our own (and those who think like us.)

It'd be nice to see your blog turn more "Christian" towards those who have different beliefs than you might - really don't see any point in continuously blasting an entire faith community (St. Cronan's) unless that anger is for some gratuitous pleasure and makes you feel better about yourself. But really ...

Yes, I need prayers as well - LOTS of them!

*BIG sigh*

Anonymous said...

... and on top of that ... 'staunchly Republican views' ???

You don't come here too often, so you *sigh*?


Unknown said...

I live in a Southern state with two dioceses and a small Catholic population. I wonder if it is common in urban areas with large Catholic populations to have churches catering to parishoners who prefer particular "flavors" of Catholicism (i.e. "traditionalists" like St. Francis de Sales Oratory and "progressives" like St. Cronan's). I wonder if these churches are kept open as "safety valves" to prevent people from defecting to another denomination or forming their own church. God bless.

Anonymous said...

There can be some coincidental benefits to dialogue with other religions. For example, I have heard priests say that some of our priests had to take the equivalency of crash courses after Vatican II in preaching and pastoral counselling, and undoubtedly Protestant ministers were able to lend a hand in these efforts. It is probably also a good thing for our priests to be good neighbors to Protestant ministers; it is certainly a very good thing to associate with the Orthodox as much as possible. Nonetheless, let us be clear that the only fundamental reason the Church (or individual Catholics) would participate in any ecumenical events would be with an aim toward converting the non-Catholics to the Church. We are not recipients in ecumemical dialogues; we are only benefactors. Signed: 200%Catholic